XeniumMods v3.xx SneakPeak!

[Bowlsnapper]

29 minutes ago, Dempsey_86 said:

Colin mcrae rally 2005 can run 480p, I was talking about Colin mcrae rally 3, this is an 480i only game.

for the folder vs xiso debate, it's the other way around, folders can give problems with some games. I gave you the advantages of xiso in the cerbios thread some days ago so I wil not go over it again. If you want to hear another plus for xiso: games that run from folders must be patched in a lot of cases to run properly. This is done by dvd2xbox with the acl patches. While these games do run they can cause problems with insignia if you want to play online.

Well, I was never under the impression that ISOs had disadvantages other than not having access to your filesystem. If a FEW folder games have issues with launch compatibility, why not just get ISOs for the ones that have compatibility issues and use folders/files for the over 800 games I have on my HDD? They work fine...

Wait... So what is the actual issue with Mcrae 3? 

What are some examples of these problematic games? What issues do they have with insignia? 

[trencherfield]

1 hour ago, NeMesiS said:

So... I'm about to place the order for a proto batch of flex cables.

 

I'm thinking about doing an extra cable to tryout EMI shielding.

This is very expensive to do a small batch with but I assume in larger

quantities the rate should get better. 

 

I was thinking the bottom side only should do.

Should I give it a try?

 

You could just use the thick self adhesive EMI foil tapes quite easily mate on that to save yourself some money to test the difference. 3M also do two versions and a copper one as well.
My older iMac was full of it inside the back of the case in true apple fashion!

I've used it before successfully on a cinema processor (lexicon) that was getting some interference from a vacuum display frequency and others.

I still have a large roll I use occasionally in projects for things.

[NeMesiS]

6 minutes ago, trencherfield said:

You could just use the thick self adhesive EMI foil tapes quite easily mate on that to save yourself some money to test the difference. 3M also do two versions and a copper one as well.
My older iMac was full of it inside the back of the case in true apple fashion!

I've used it before successfully on a cinema processor (lexicon) that was getting some interference from a vacuum display frequency and others.

I still have a large roll I use occasionally in projects for things.

Great idea...

 

But I'm running on fumes atm... I need a good week off from this after I place my orders.

Plus it would be best to see how it comes together at the factory.

I'm sure they'll want me to add some details to the design for the EMI shielding.

I figured I'd just send the design as is and see if they request any changes.

 

[trencherfield]

The Cromwell is the basis. As NeMesis has said and is referring to, is that it can be very difficult getting a Bios to work both with all the board versions, the Xbox kernel, the Xenium and other chip OS as well, especially where video output and scaling is concerned.

For example on a V1.0 using Xenium OS it had the bug of fragging when trying to boot Xblast from the Xenium chip. This would not happen on the other board versions. Same as the 1.6 line problem which was solved of course. These are the difficulties.

Yes there are people who can code and do this, some are probably watching. I'll tell you now, more often than not, despite what you offer, or how polite you may be asking, it's unfortunate but they generally can't be arsed. It's lucky there's the Cerbios team and I would say, if the HDMI board (I have a few to assemble) can work well, then hopefully that team might offer a patch for it, which would be very generous on their part.

Going opensource, in my view would encourage this.

[Bowlsnapper]

1 hour ago, trencherfield said:

The Cromwell is the basis. As NeMesis has said and is referring to, is that it can be very difficult getting a Bios to work both with all the board versions, the Xbox kernel, the Xenium and other chip OS as well, especially where video output and scaling is concerned.

For example on a V1.0 using Xenium OS it had the bug of fragging when trying to boot Xblast from the Xenium chip. This would not happen on the other board versions. Same as the 1.6 line problem which was solved of course. These are the difficulties.

Yes there are people who can code and do this, some are probably watching. I'll tell you now, more often than not, despite what you offer, or how polite you may be asking, it's unfortunate but they generally can't be arsed. It's lucky there's the Cerbios team and I would say, if the HDMI board (I have a few to assemble) can work well, then hopefully that team might offer a patch for it, which would be very generous on their part.

Going opensource, in my view would encourage this.

Thank you for clarifying this to me. I did and do not understand all the nuanced considerations involved in designing a bios. If it were to remain open source, it would be impossible to make a new Xecuter chip. It's my only problem with open source: It's way harder to Develop a super product like that. I don't know if it's been done in the Xbox arena. I don't think so. However, that may be what a lot of people prefer. I never even asked. Maybe I'm only asking for what I would want instead of most other people. I am notoriously ignorant but still can't help speaking on things like I know what I'm talking about. Yes, you are correct that even with what would appear to be sufficient and moral motivation, the capable individuals would not be convinced to code or engineer this. I'm legitimately bummed.  A lot of my motivation comes from wanting strongly to create a light side to Dustin's perceived dark. I feel like a wrong has been committed and he's being allowed to get away with it. It's easy for me to end up in a sellout state of mind if I'm trying to achieve that goal. You know what I mean?

How does that patch work, anyway? Would the developers just have to code support from scratch? How does modification like that work anyway, if you were to explain HDMI patching to a semi-Layperson?

[Dempsey_86]

7 hours ago, Bowlsnapper said:

Wait... So what is the actual issue with Mcrae 3? 

no there is no problem with cm3. I was saying to nemesis this game was working with an unpatched bios with the HD+. considered this is a 480i game this should not work but it does.

for examples of problem with insignia check there discord.

6 hours ago, trencherfield said:

The Cromwell is the basis. As NeMesis has said and is referring to, is that it can be very difficult getting a Bios to work both with all the board versions, the Xbox kernel, the Xenium and other chip OS as well, especially where video output and scaling is concerned.

I think the big challenge is the 3 different video encoders. The kernel is not that big of a problem. I think the kernel is not that different from each other because later games must also work on v1.0 hardware for example.

[Bowlsnapper]

5 hours ago, Dempsey_86 said:

no there is no problem with cm3. I was saying to nemesis this game was working with an unpatched bios with the HD+. considered this is a 480i game this should not work but it does.

for examples of problem with insignia check there discord.

I think the big challenge is the 3 different video encoders. The kernel is not that big of a problem. I think the kernel is not that different from each other because later games must also work on v1.0 hardware for example.

How come I always gotta go someplace else for examples of issues? I'll just start a thread. I'll try to find out which games have problems loading so i can get settled on that as well.

[trencherfield]

11 hours ago, Bowlsnapper said:

Thank you for clarifying this to me. I did and do not understand all the nuanced considerations involved in designing a bios. If it were to remain open source, it would be impossible to make a new Xecuter chip. It's my only problem with open source: It's way harder to Develop a super product like that. I don't know if it's been done in the Xbox arena. I don't think so. However, that may be what a lot of people prefer. I never even asked. Maybe I'm only asking for what I would want instead of most other people. I am notoriously ignorant but still can't help speaking on things like I know what I'm talking about. Yes, you are correct that even with what would appear to be sufficient and moral motivation, the capable individuals would not be convinced to code or engineer this. I'm legitimately bummed.  A lot of my motivation comes from wanting strongly to create a light side to Dustin's perceived dark. I feel like a wrong has been committed and he's being allowed to get away with it. It's easy for me to end up in a sellout state of mind if I'm trying to achieve that goal. You know what I mean?

How does that patch work, anyway? Would the developers just have to code support from scratch? How does modification like that work anyway, if you were to explain HDMI patching to a semi-Layperson?

As Nemesis said, I would not fret at this point mate. Highly likely, we would hope, that one of the teams will kindly help with this if they can. There is something else I had in mind that I can't mention here currently, but it looks like Nemesis is already on that path looking at his HDMI board pcb.

Hopefully the hardware performs well enough in the outset. I haven't assembled any because I have had a retinal bleed in my eye for the past year and having regular injections into the eye. Have another coming soon, ugh. So obviously looking into a scope and soldering isn't viable in that state.

If I manage to do some HDMI boards I would happily donate a few to the team for development so everyone can get this.

[NeMesiS]

 

19 hours ago, NeMesiS said:

I'm sure they'll want me to add some details to the design for the EMI shielding.

I figured I'd just send the design as is and see if they request any changes.

 @trencherfield I need your opinion... The manufacturers are asking:

Quote: "Do you need to do GND connection for the EMI film"

I already have a good grounding on bottom layer of the flex cable.

But is it good practice to ground the EMI film also?

[trencherfield]

3 minutes ago, NeMesiS said:

 

 @trencherfield I need your opinion... The manufacturers are asking:

Quote: "Do you need to do GND connection for the EMI film"

I already have a good grounding on bottom layer of the flex cable.

But is it good practice to ground the EMI film also?

Ohhh lordy.... you did not just ask that question lol The army of cinema/HIFI purists have stood up and marching your way haha.

People argue about this to infinity.

Common arguments;

1) If you don't ground it you'll gradually induce voltage in the shield.

2) Ground one end only for a drain path so to speak, grounding both can induce ground loops etc blah blah.

3) No, ground both ends so the RF can tunnel away...

Me, personally, I don't ground them no. The shielding on the Lexicon (£6K+ processors) worked great, solved the issue. No ground. Generally Hi Fi etc won't ground, some do, some don't. The Lexicon used a Medical Grade switching power supply (noisy) had ground, so obviously didn't want to induce that from the chassis.

If the masses that want it grounded, I dunno, run one end through a diode to ground to please them.

This is an Xbox though  Me I'd just shield it.

 

[NeMesiS]

Hmmm...

 

I'll just go with no grounding. Still haven't decided to use the EMI shielding on the final product or not.

I have other concerns, I worry that the film might just peel off over time especially where the flex cable

bends to meet up with the HDMI mod PCB. One solution would be to see if they'll let me tuck the film

underneath the PI stiffener by a small about. Or we ground that end of the film to help prevent peeling.

But peeling may not end up being a concern at all, I'm just trying to anticipate any issues.

 

I'd prefer to avoid using a diode on the flex cable as it would incur assemble fee for one component.

Not sure if a diode coming off the flex cable connector on the HDMI pcb would have a similar effect.

 

If anything worries me about picture quality, it would be RF...

I wonder if it would be worth getting a EM/RF meter with a probe.

[NeMesiS]

Alright I guess the objective is to have a completely standalone HDMI mod without any dependencies on BIOS.

I think the biggest issue is interlaced support for 480i and possibly 1080i by deinterlacing.

Wiki: "Deinterlacing is the process of converting interlaced video into a non-interlaced or progressive form."

EDIT: This is what I'm hoping to do...

 

The next step would be to test the XboxHD+ (non-stellar) with a 1080i game while using an un-patched bios

to see if any deinterlacing was implemented. I think the easiest solution was to use a force 480p patch.

Does it force 480p on all games including those that support 720p and/or 1080i?

What does forcing 480p do to XBMC when it's set to 720p or higher?

 

 

Edited June 30, 2023 by NeMesiS

[trencherfield]

2 minutes ago, NeMesiS said:

Hmmm...

 

I'll just go with no grounding. Still haven't decided to use the EMI shielding on the final product or not.

I have other concerns, I worry that the film might just peel off over time especially where the flex cable

bends to meet up with the HDMI mod PCB. One solution would be to see if they'll let me tuck the film

underneath the PI stiffener by a small about. Or we ground that end of the film to help prevent peeling.

But peeling may not end up being a concern at all, I'm just trying to anticipate any issues.

 

I'd prefer to avoid using a diode on the flex cable as it would incur assemble fee for one component.

Not sure if a diode coming off the flex cable connector on the HDMI pcb would have a similar effect.

 

If anything worries me about picture quality, it would be RF...

I wonder if it would be worth getting a EM/RF meter with a probe.

Not a dig here obviously, but man, your OCD is making matters too complicated for yourself. Really.

The EMI shielding film is really good. Various thickness available no doubt. I will tell you now the adhesive on mine never undoes itself, super sticky, even bent. I use it for heat protection too when using hot air on top of kapton and it's a sod to get off actually!

The diode was tongue in cheek for the moaners, you only have to google "EMI shield ground?" to see the faff.

The digital signal will not need a ground for the shield on it. 100% on that. So tell them no.

Any defect to the digital signal will only be digital deviation (jitter) and it's not getting re-clocked with a crystal etc so, honestly not much you can do. I would say there's more degradation to the signal and reflection by leaving the video chip on the m/board.

So summing up, you can order some shielded (no ground) if you wish to see any perceived improvement. Me I'd just use the tape on them. Copper 3M would be super fancy. Probably removing the chip would do more if it doesn't cause a frag etc.

[trencherfield]

10 minutes ago, NeMesiS said:

Alright I guess the objective is to have a completely standalone HDMI mod without any dependencies on BIOS.

I think the biggest issue is interlaced support for 480i and possibly 1080i by deinterlacing.

Wiki: "Deinterlacing is the process of converting interlaced video into a non-interlaced or progressive form."

EDIT: This is what I'm hoping to do...

 

The next step would be to test the XboxHD+ (non-stellar) with a 1080i game while using an un-patched bios

to see if any deinterlacing was implemented. I think the easiest solution was to use a force 480p patch.

Does it force 480p on all games including those that support 720p and/or 1080i?

What does forcing 480p do to XBMC when it's set to 720p or higher?

 

 

Depends on the BIOS. Generally one of mine boots the flubber at 480i then it reloads the end X box logo as the bios is read for force 480p then loads XBMC in progressive too.

The patches are different and game specific really on the XBE launch like the original fixes for the 1.6 that you could apply for Panther Dragoon etc.

Just get your order in, build your PCB up and test it out first  and get some rest in the mean time yeah. Leave it for now while the stuff comes in.

[NeMesiS]

11 minutes ago, trencherfield said:

Not a dig here obviously, but man, your OCD is making matters too complicated for yourself. Really.

I did mention I have OCPD and that I will need you guys to tell me when to chill to out. LoL...

So... I used to be a Civil Site Foreman. I was responsible for alot of shit.

 

A small mistake can add up to thousands of dollars very quickly.

On one site we got fined $30k for breaking a branch off a tree.

Another $30k to replace a streetlight after one of our trucks backed into it.

 

11 minutes ago, trencherfield said:

Just get your order in, build your PCB up and test it out first  and get some rest in the mean time yeah. Leave it for now while the stuff comes in.

 

Your right...

I need to do absolutely nothing for a week and just play some video games to get this out of my head for a while.

I was gonna make a couple of small changes to the HDMI mod but fuck it, I can do that on the final proto batch.

[NeMesiS]

We could start works on the HDMI firmware before we have a working prototype.

By reprogramming the MakeMHz XboxHD+ (non-stellar) board. (STM32 MCU)

All you need is a $3 "ST-LINK v2" programmer and a way to connect to the PROG. header.

EDIT: I've already done some tinkering, just need to do an install on a spare console.

Edited June 30, 2023 by NeMesiS

[NeMesiS]

PCB's ordered...

It worked out cheaper doing the flex cables and pcb's at different manufacturers.

Just gotta add the last few components for testing the prototypes to my DigiKey order.

[NeMesiS]

Well that wasn't cheap, small orders suck...

It is what it is, I don't even wanna know what the total was.

I had to order a bunch of components that I didnt have on hand.

I kinda just made do last time but it was just the modchip.

 

Since the modchip is a couple of steps ahead of the HDMI mod in development.

My plans are to order 100x XeniumICE v3.0 modchips first and shortly after 100x XeniumHD+ mods

including all the supporting hardware and cables. I could definitely order more but I think it would

be safer to see how the first batch goes out in the wild before committing to larger orders.

Plus I should be able to cover the costs of a smaller order without needing to do pre-orders and such.

 

Tomorrow is the start of the new financial year, after I do a quick stocktake I'll start a EOFY sale on Revision 2.1 hardware.

The more funds I can raise in the meantime the less I have to worry about when ordering the first batch of things.

[Donnie-Burger]

29 minutes ago, NeMesiS said:

Well that wasn't cheap, small orders suck...

It is what it is, I don't even wanna know what the total was.

I had to order a bunch of components that I didnt have on hand.

I kinda just made do last time but it was just the modchip.

 

Since the modchip is a couple of steps ahead of the HDMI mod in development.

My plans are to order 100x XeniumICE v3.0 modchips first and shortly after 100x XeniumHD+ mods

including all the supporting hardware and cables. I could definitely order more but I think it would

be safer to see how the first batch goes out in the wild before committing to larger orders.

Plus I should be able to cover the costs of a smaller order without needing to do pre-orders and such.

 

Tomorrow is the start of the new financial year, after I do a quick stocktake I'll start a EOFY sale on Revision 2.1 hardware.

The more funds I can raise in the meantime the less I have to worry about when ordering the first batch of things.

Count me in!  Following this closely

[NeMesiS]

 

I sent off a handful of parcels to some volunteers to try out some of my 3D prints, in particular the Dual 80mm Fan Caddy and everything necessary to make it work. I'll be posting some quick install guides...

I still have one parcel for anyone interested it testing.

 

[NeMesiS]

In order to install the dual fan caddy we first need to relocate the HDD over to where the DVDrom goes. Start by installing the DVD bezel bracket. I included two versions, a slim version for use on it's own and a fat version for use with HDD caddy. There's also a DVD pcb module that connects to the DVDrom cable, this helps prevent XBMC, etc. from crashing when using file manager. Not sure if Cerbios has a fix for this.

Edited July 11, 2023 by NeMesiS

[NeMesiS]

Next we have the HDD caddy, pretty simple just attaches to the DVDrom bracket thingy.

Slotted mounting screw holes on the underside. If you're wanting to use a 2.5" drive, I'd recommend the Orico 3.5" to 2.5" adaptor.

You can get away with a short Ultra IDE cable since the HDD is now super close to the IDE connector. But you will need to extend the molex power cable. I've been using rather long extension cables so I can route the cable around the front of the console instead of the back.

[NeMesiS]

Optional 60mm fan housing (friction fit) and CPU/PSU divider.

If you look at the previous images you might notice that I cut a bit of the DVDrom bracket thingy to allow a bit extra clearance for the 60mm fan cable.

In the above image I'm using a Noctua 60mm "FLK" fan connected directly to the 3pin fan header.

Alternatively a "PWM" fan could be used but you guys might have to look into that further as they would probably need some sort of PWM fan controller.

[NeMesiS]

Next, we prepare the dual fan caddy by installing the 80mm fans.

Insert them from the bottom side, flip it over and screw down the top plate.

I designed the caddy around the Noctua 80mm Chromax PWM fans.

As they have a short lead, making custom cable for optimal fitment is possible.

[NeMesiS]

 

Flip it back over again and insert the legs to the caddy and place caddy into the console.

The reason I needed testers is to see how they go about cable management.

Testers have the option of using either FLK or PWM fans.

Or a hybrid of the two having the case fan FLK and 80mm PWM fans for example.

I think it would be possible to run 3x FLK fans from a single header.

I would like to do a PWM fan controller based on mobo and cpu temps at some point.

Testers can use whatever fans they please, they don't have to go with noctua.

 

This guide was a bit rushed so if anyone has any questions please ask...